On Differences Between Appreciation of Beauty and Gendered Expectations of Appreciation of Beauty

KinkInExile has this to say about beauty. It's not clear that she's talking about gendered beauty but it's clear she's talking about her beauty.

For all the time and money I spend on beauty, fashion and the like, this morning caught me by surprise.  This morning, for reasons that are far too convoluted to go into right now, I ended up breaking down tents, dragging around easy ups, packing trucks, loading and unloading food, and generally scrambling to pull things out of the Occupy Oakland encampment ahead of an advancing police line in the mud while also smiling at and trying to be friendly and engaging toward the police.  After what felt like a sprint of activity both in its intensity and its briefness, as I disrobed next to the washing machine in my apartment and stood in a hallway, sweaty, sore, and naked except for the bandana I had used to tie my unwashed hair out of my face, I realized I hadn’t felt that beautiful in ages.

Source: Kink In Exile

I raise that mostly to contrast with an anonymous correspondent to Em & Lo implicitly offered a substantially gendered view of beauty in general and hers in particular.

Why do guys cheat down? Meaning, picking a woman less attractive. My husband cheated on me with a woman twice my size. He said he found her unattractive but couldn’t help himself. Another friend of mine (she is a model) had her husband cheat on her. It was while he was out of town and all the women were less attractive. Of course these are just two examples. I was always under the impression that if you are going to cheat, at least make it worth it.

She said it here.

So the first question should always be who's idea of beauty are we talking about? Society's? The correspondents? Her partners? My guess is that there's a difference in her experience of society's philosophy of men's relationship beauty and her partner's actual experience of it. (Which is in collision with his experience of society's expectation of him.)

Second question: What makes so many people think that conventional/consensus beauty is the only reliable metric for male attraction? Especially when it so often isn't a very good metric?

Third question: What makes her think beauty for men is an apex rather than a threshold, such that no matter how beautiful one woman is men will inevitably prefer someone even more beautiful?

Fourth question: When woman A is less beautiful but still preferred to woman B, why is the assumption that woman A must "give better head?")

Fifth question: Where do so many people get the idea that beauty is like some kind of points system such that if you’ve got more you automatically win? Or else that it’s an entitlement such that if you’ve got more you should automatically win?

Next question: Would the correspondent feel somehow better if he instead cheated “up?” (If so… if one really would feel better… then stop right there and think about that! Because really?)

Final question: I’m… pretty sure the correspondent would feel insulted if someone suggested that she, like "all women," was attracted to men based only on the gendered masculine quality of income or worth. So why think that men, including her partner, are attracted only on the gendered feminine quality of “beauty?”

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As long as we're on the subject of gendered notions of attraction, try running the numbers again for men, substituting worthiness for beauty. For question four, replace "must give good head" with "must have a big dick."

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A lot of years ago a now-dark blogger named Sam Sugar, trying to make a claim about men's nature, said something like "given two women with similarly attractive personalities men will choose the more beautiful one every time." It's actually even true... but not particularly telling. First because what at least ought to be an obvious corollary: "given two women with similar beauty, men will choose the one with the more attractive personality. Second the same true but empty observation could be made about women's attraction to men.

I think the fallacy, which Sam Sugar was perpetuating and which I think a lot of people fall for, is the idea that men simply aren't aware of any qualities other than beauty in women such that they express deep surprise when men actually do enjoy and often prefer other qualities more.

Similarly, of course, it seems to perpetually surprise people when women fail to ignore beauty in men.

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If you look at beauty in KinkInExile's terms I think it's a lot harder to have disconnects between social expectations and our actual experiences.

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Disclaimer: I know I sound like I'm all about heteronormativity all the time. Instead just think there's a lot more unconscious assumptions to question about heteronormativity, and that it takes a lot more effort to become conscious of them.


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I have a vivid memory of the

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Mon, 2011-11-21 16:20.

I have a vivid memory of the time my high school boyfriend dumped me for a girl who was considered quite homely. I can recall looking out the window of the office of one of my teachers and seeing the two of them engaged in PDA on a bench outside. To make matters worse, it was late spring and the guy had taken his shirt off, which I thought was really pretty blatant of him. I didn't start to cry or anything, but I must have looked very upset, as my teacher immediately came over and said "What's wrong?" I pointed downward. He saw what I was looking at,  his eyebrows went up, and he said softly, "Oooohhhh." I don't remember everything he said to try to cheer me up, except that he ended up saying, "She's not a very attractive girl. Not nearly as attractive as you," and then (I think) realized he probably shouldn't be saying that and shut up (to his generation, "attractive" was mostly another word for pretty: he wasn't making a declaration or anything).

 

Anyway, I remember thinking what good does that do me, why on earth would it matter? If anything, I would rather be dumped for a homely girl with brains and personality (which that girl did have, no question) than for a mindless bimbo. But a few days later I was in the girls' bathroom (this was such a classic high school moment) and a couple of younger girls came in chatting about how she was so ugly, and how could he stand to go out with her. "Oh," one of them said cheerfully, "he always picks ugly girls." Then of course I was unable to exit the stall until they had finished brushing their hair and giggling, and I was late for class on top of everything else, having naturally to wash my face from crying and look in the mirror muttering that I wasn't as bad as all that, surely I was average at least. At that point it was some comfort to me that I had recently been told I was attractive, but I also found myself upset for the other girl, who, whatever she may have deserved, didn't deserve that kind of shaming, and probably got a lot of it.

 

They ended up going out for over a year, and he clearly thought she was wonderful and just didn't give a damn whether anyone else thought she was pretty. There's a lot to be said for that attitude.

"At that point it was some

Submitted by figleaf on Mon, 2011-11-21 17:31.

"At that point it was some comfort to me that I had recently been told I was attractive, but I also found myself upset for the other girl, who, whatever she may have deserved, didn't deserve that kind of shaming..."

I didn't mean to suggest it's stupid or cruel to find comfort where you can when you're heartbroken. But it sounds like what mattered was that you were heartbroken, not that he or she were violating some kind of unwritten beauty rule.

Thanks for commenting, Anonymous.

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Oh, no, you didn't suggest

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Mon, 2011-11-21 18:22.

Oh, no, you didn't suggest that at all. I was just  strongly reminded of this incident and thinking that it probably illustrated a lot of complex, slightly different attitudes toward the phenomenon of "cheating down." But I need to think about it some more.

It is unfortunate that our

Submitted by Kitten (not verified) on Fri, 2011-11-25 10:33.

It is unfortunate that our society put so much emphasis on physical beauty and no emphasis on inner beauty.
We first need to redefine 'beauty'. I admire men who will stand proudly, love boldly and publicly a woman who is labelled 'unattractive'. It means that he can see beyond the illusion to the heart of a person where true beauty lies. That is why men leave and cheat on their 'beautiful' partners for those who are 'less so'

No one is (physically) beautiful forever. Relationships that are based on this criteria is built on sand. They will not last. Great post.

I used to teach at a college;

Submitted by Mike Howell (not verified) on Mon, 2011-11-28 05:52.

I used to teach at a college; a few years ago, I had an evening class with about fifteen men and five or six women. Two of the women were exactly what "society" calls beautiful...they looked liked models or TV stars. One of the women was not conventionally beautiful, but she had an effervescent personality. The classically beautiful women got little attention from the men, who flocked around the girl who was a bit homely but who had the bright, energy-giving personality. I think you mentioned in a previous post that men want the same things everyone else does in relationships, so maybe men are more attracted to women who seem to be capable of giving those things, and maybe men find a broader range of features potentially beautiful in relation to that.

Also, another commenter said "to his generation, "attractive" was mostly another word for pretty: he wasn't making a declaration or anything." I don't think this is reallya generational attribute; I see it much more in the current group of college students than I see it in, say, the 30-and-up crowd.

For most average-looking folks, if I may use that term, I think the ability to make a person feel accepted, understood, affirmed, included and/or valued will trump the beauty factor every time when an actual relationship, rather than casual sex, is sought. Looks are only really important to the degree they reflect a person's self-love.

 

Mike

Original anon here. Maybe the

Submitted by Anonymous (not verified) on Mon, 2011-11-28 11:12.

Original anon here. Maybe the use of "attractive=pretty" has come back. I don't remember my contemporaries (late forties) using the term "attractive" that much at all, whether literally or figuratively. I thought at the time it was a bit ironic that my teacher had happened to use that particular term, given that obviously the other girl had been more literally attractive in this case.

I'm told that strikingly beautiful women often have problems with people either assuming they're taken, or being rather intimidated by them. I don't suppose that's universal, but it has certainly happened to a few women I've known (probably men too, now that I think about it).

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