fashion industry

Blast From the Past: A Post About the Search for Matching Bras and Panties for Small-Busted Adult Women

Sun, 2010-09-19 09:56

A few years ago I remember reading that the average dress size for American woman is now 12 or 14 (can't remember) and the average bra size is now D.

It's rather well-established that the fashion industry very shabbily serves the fashion interests of average size, let alone above-average sizes. It's less well-established that the industry also shabbily serves adult women who are undersized.

Back when my blog was more about the ins and outs of sex than the cultural influences and consequences of it I was online friends with a number of women bloggers who were highly fashion-conscious but very small breasted. Small-breasted in the specific sense that the "foundation garment" industry didn't produce bras, slips, camisoles, or lingerie in general that simultaneously a) looked sexy but also b) fit them.

While surfing to see who was referring to my site this morning I ran across vintage erotica collector Silent Porn Star. I'd lost track of her years ago but as of March 2010 she seems to be back.) Anyway, while catching up with posts (she's interested in everything from naughty embroidery to cheesie "nudist camp" jigsaw puzzles to scholarly analysisPaul Klee and sexual fluidity) I noticed she kept referencing the author of the vintage lingerie blog Slip of a Girl.

And to get back to the original point of this post, I ran across Slip of a Girl's post Smaller Busted Or Know Someone Who Is? An Exclusive Interview With Lula Lu Petite Lingerie Designer Ellen Shing! Shing owns what Slip of a Girl says is the only retail shop in the U.S. and Canada that caters to small-busted women of all heights and sizes.

[SoaG] As a larger busted woman, and indeed a larger woman in general (actually, I am average size, but you know how fashion goes!), I've often been frustrated with way sizes are created. If I'm unhappy with the poor fit of the ill-conceived "just add a few inches all over," I imagine the problems are similar with "just shrink it all over." How does Lula Lu actually address the proper lingerie sizing for petite women?

[Shing] We don't start with a 34B, like many bra companies do for the fit of our bras as it makes no sense as we haven't even really added B cups to our collection! We start with AA cups and work our way up a little to an A cup and down a little to a AAA cup to keep things accurate. We keep the range of our sizes focused and test the size samples on actual women of each size to make sure they fit well. Having said that, no bra can ever fit everyone perfectly in a particular size because everyone's built differently and thus the bras will wear differently on women's bodies (and you also have to account for everyone's different tastes on how they would like to appear in a bra).<

...

[SoaG] Do you feel that the American obsession with big breasts (and implants) have negatively impacted not only the smaller-busted, perhaps, with self-esteem issues, but lingerie companies and retailers too — resulting in offering less options for those women with petite bustlines?

[Shing] Most of my customers are happy with their body type and bust size and they just feel defeated by the actual bra shopping experience when they realize that they cannot find anything that fits them or are told to go to the children's department. I think the biggest misconception about women with small busts is that the all want to appear like they have a big bust. It's not true and a lot of my customers like their shape and just want some bras that fit well. Read the whole interview here.

A lot of my old blogging friends have moved on, their sites are now dark, and I don't know how many of them still read me. And if they do I'm sure they'll be tickled that I'd stick with the issues of sizing lingerie instead of, oh, maybe what Shing's products actually look like and whether I think they're sexy (they look nice, I think they're sexy.)

Not everyone cares about fashion, but some people do. And like most people in general, most of those who do care about fashion don't have the standard 34B body industry seems to insist on designing for. There's been more activism lately to get industry to begin accommodating actual average bodies. But it's nice that someone's taking the interests of "minus" sized women, most of whom also aren't model shaped seriously.

Penurious Average Fashion-Modelling Incomes: Bug or Intentional Feature?

Tue, 2009-07-21 11:21

Tatiana the Anonymous Model explains at Jezebel (actually now a former model) explains

I worked two months in Australia last year, after agency fees and the rent were deducted, nearly AU$5,000 worth of earnings became AU$690.90. Less than the cost of my airfare, certainly less than the cost of the food and subway passes I’d had to charge during the trip. I left Sydney in November. I didn’t get my $690.90 — $413.70, after wire transfer fees and currency conversion — until this April. “At least,” said the agency accountant, “you worked!”

I had to get used to living however, and wherever, I could. Like in a tiny Washington Heights studio. Milan was a single room in a long-stay hotel with a hot plate, a bar fridge, and two other models. I still don’t know how much I paid for that; I was too afraid to ask my booker at Elite Milan.

Read the quote in context here.

That sounds about right. What’s wiggy, and what I think helps perpetuate the low wages and, consequently, the high stress, uncertainty, and meager rations that surely lead to “desired” low weights and pasty completions, can be summed up in that line by her booking agent’s reply when she complained about how awful the pay ends up being: “At least you worked!”

Very glamorous.

Hair Pressure

Tue, 2009-03-31 00:26

fMhLisa of Feminist Mormon Housewives has a great rundown on the obligation women feel to shave their legs. And by extension anywhere else.

I was sitting on mfranti’s couch, when the evening light hit my legs at the right angle and she (in that uber mormon-nice way of hers) screeched, “Ahhh! Leg Hair! Ewww!” while pulling her gag face. I don’t really blame her, truth be told, I often have the same reaction. Especially when I put on my dressy boots and the leg hair kinda flops out over the top, ewww. Run Away!

So why not shave? you ask, and save yourself the horror of the leg-hair boot flop.

Well, I’m totally lazy.

Plus the getting old thing, simultaneously less attractive (chin haired, boob sagged, and wrinkled) and more comfortable with myself (dude I’m totally awesome, I kid you not).

And then there’s the ideology. Though I’m never really sure if my ideology is an excuse for the laziness or my laziness is an excuse for my ideology (one wouldn’t want to come off as a militant weirdo).

She said it here.

This is going to sound like a total digression. It’s not.

Back before I was “figleaf,” in fact back before blogs, I spent a lot of time on the old Usenet newsgroups pertaining to pregnancy, childbirth, and parenting. And because I was a stay at home dad I talked occasionallly about shopping and cooking.

One day, sort of out of the blue, I got an email from a reporter from a national cooking magaine asking if she could interview me about being a dad in the kitchen. I said sure and after a little back and forth I sent her my phone number. When she called she spent a minute or two asking a couple of general how-are-you question like how did I like being a stay-at-home dad and how often did I cook. But then she started asking me how my mother’s cooking influenced my cooking. I said not at all, my mom hated to cook and except for a couple of pretty good scratch recipes she relied heavily on cans, freezers, and (when it came on the market) Hamburger Helper. I started to tell her instead that I’d gotten the idea when an african american woman from our church stayed with us for a week when mom needed surgery and mentioned that, since she worked during the day, her son, who was my age and in my Sunday school class, would cook his own lunches.

No, no, says the interviewer, can you tell me more about how you learned recipes from your mom. And I said, well, I didn’t really learn any recipes from my mom. Instead I was bored one summer and read the Joy of Cooking cover to cover and… No, no, says the interviewer, what recipes did your mom use that you use now? And I said, well, I guess I make macaroni and cheese from a box the way she did but, really, I read this short story about a chef in upstate New York who… And the interviewer said “it sounds like you didn’t really learn to cook from your mom.” And I said no, I learned… And she said thank you, but my editor wants stories about stay at home dads and how they learned from their mothers. And she thanked me again.

And that was the end of that.

I mention this because a friend and I were talking today about gender and fashion and somehow shaving came up. And I opined, based on my old hippie friend’s experiences with “straight” boys and men, that men aren’t really as concerned about shaving (legs and armpits back then) as they were made out to be. I mean, sure, they might say something. But they didn’t run screaming from the room. And, for that matter, later many of them became hippies themselves. And stopped shaving. Their faces.

My friend brought up the point that thanks to porn men are insisting that women shave not just legs and armpits but pubic hair before they’ll have sex with them. And I was thinking… you know… it wasn’t that long ago that men, not just hippie men but “mainstream” men, were suspicious of women who shaved their pubic hair. (We won’t even go into the whole, stupid “does the rug match the drapes” business, m’kay?) And it wasn’t that much longer before that that porn would rave on and on and on about “luxuriant” pubic hair being an indication of sexual appetite. So I said I still didn’t think that many men are really refusing to have sex with their partners because they don’t shave.

And my friend said (and here’s where my digression stops looking so digress-y) that she didn’t know. “Even” Cosmopolitan is obsessed with the importance of shaving body hair. And she mentioned that any time they run an “ask men” feature that involves pubic hair, sure enough, all the men insist they can’t even get it up for sex with someone with anything less than a full-on Brazilian wax.

And I thought about how the article the reporter who contacted me was all about men who were influenced to cook by their mothers.

Hmm….

I’m not saying it doesn’t happen. It absolutely does. But probably no more often than women insist they won’t go near a man with back hair. In other words, it happens. But in one case word of every instance carries a ton of freight; in the other it vanishes with scarcely a ripple.

Which brings me to my next point. The Las Vegas Courtesan (l’ll link in a minute) writes intelligently and in the first person about sex-worker issues. She also does self-photography and posts them. The photos are not “half-nekkid” and, since photos like that aren’t everyone’s cup of tea I wanted to let you know that if you following this link would take you to a photo of LVC minus underwear, plus pubic hair.

I mention this because the comments are are relevant. And again for those who’d rather not check out the photo I’ve quoted them below. (The second comment is from LVC.)

#Nice shot. Very hot! Love the nude and the hands, so much more erotic.
Glad to see the “bald” look hasn’t completely taken over. (Much sexier IMHO).
March 29th, 2009 at 7:15 pm

  1. lasvegascourtesan Says:

Yea I am going to take some more photos before I get waxed again because I know quite a few people like the natural look. :)
March 29th, 2009 at 7:42 pm

  1. Thru.Blu.Eyes Says:

Stomach and legs are awesome! I agree about the “bald” look. It seems so predominant everywhere you look now. I prefer smooth lips and a little hair on the mound. Landing strip, triangle, heart, doesn’t matter. I just like women to look like, well, women. Love your pictures on the site, LVC. Very erotic and sexy.
March 29th, 2009 at 8:52 pm

  1. John Says:

Awesome picture! Very erotic and I love the not so bald look. Slightly trimmed is a much better look in my opinion. Mmmm, thanks for sharing!
March 30th, 2009 at 4:19 am

  1. Jeff Says:

Very nice picture… I agree with previous notes about liking a little patch of hair more than simply bald. Don’t be fooled though! I personally don’t like the forest look

Say anything you like about the overall tone of the comments, but it’s kind of inescapable that

a) the four men who chose to comment affirmed a bias towards at least some pubic hair.
b) only the last one, Jeff, chose to say anything even slightly negative (he doesn’t like a lot of pubic hair.) Another commenter said affirmatively that he likes slightly trimmed pubic hair. (Call it a cliché, or call me a whiner, but since pubic hair really does go up your nose I prefer trimmed pubic hair too.)
c) LVC acknowledges that “quite a few people like the natural look.”

Again, it could just be that commenter #5 hasn’t come along. Or it could be that would-be commenters #5 through #5000 all retired to their fainting couches a la the Romantic artist John Ruskin on (allegedly) his wedding night. But I doubt it. Instead, the first four outside comments about a (literal!) “pornstitution” photograph said, more or less, “cool, pubic hair.”

As opposed to “‘Ahhh! Leg Hair! Ewww!’ while pulling her gag face.”

Question Authority, m’kay?

Oh, and go read the rest of fMhLisa’s post. Compared to my rambling anecdotes she directly articulates why the pressure (in her case from other women, but from men as well) is overblown. And generally worth ignoring.

Pocket Patriarchy: Keeping Dependent Children... At Least Girl Children... Dependent Into Adulthood

Mon, 2009-02-23 15:13

Michael O’Hare of WWW.samefacts.com/archives/feminism/2009/02/annals_of_sexist_oppression.php”>The RBC makes what might be considered a belated discovery…

In the middle of a long thread on a writers’ list-serv, provoked by my post on fashion models, it occurred to me that one of the unrecognized ways women are kept dependent and threatened is simply denying them pockets. This is more important than one might think, right up there with hobbling them with high heels and way more effective than an upper-body-strength advantage.

...

Why does this matter? Well, think what autonomous adults do, almost tautologically: they admit themselves to secure locations with keys, show identification, write on paper, start a car, read (think glasses), spend money with cash and credit cards, check mail and talk on their cellphones.

I can do any of those grownup things instantly, almost all with one hand, while walking, and neither miss a step nor look away from my surroundings for a second. With the jacket, I have pockets to spare for an iPod, papers, a candy bar, and even a book. A woman, however, dressed for business in slacks or a skirt and a jacket, or even wearing loose-fitting casual clothes, will have no usable pockets and has to carry a handbag. It takes both her hands and several therbligs to accomplish any adult task, never mind looking and groping inside the bag for the appropriate tool.

The handbag itself is disempowering; it’s prey to a thief just walking on the street unless clutched (there’s one hand occupied), and for sure hanging on a chair in a cafe, while a man only has to worry about a skilled pickpocket or a strongarm mugger.

Form, Formula, Foundation Wear... and Fallacies

Tue, 2008-12-16 12:46


Photo by Flickr user zmxncbv.com. Used under a Creative Commons license.

Last week it seemed like more people than usual were (coincidentally) talking about vasectomies. This week I’ve noticed more than the usual number of posts about breasts. As a result I’ve got a couple of things I want to say about breasts as well. Here’s a good place to start. Dr Petra Boynton, tipping her hat to a post by Bad Science’s Ben Goldacre

As you may know, one thing that winds me up nearly as much as dodgy surveys for PR purposes it’s using fake formulae to promote products. The formulae I’ve taken most issue with have been those supposedly identifying ‘perfect’ breast and sizes or what the ideal Page 3 girl’s vital statistics should be, although there have been formula created for just about any purpose you can imagine – anything from the perfect consistency of a biscuit through to which day of the year is the most depressing.

None of the formulae ever really make any mathematical sense, but then they’re not supposed to. They are designed simply to get a product mentioned in the papers. And that message is always emphasised by the appearance of a ‘scientist’, ‘psychologist’, or ‘boffin’ (often from Cambridge University) who will give weight to the maths. They can get pretty shirty if you tell them their formulae don’t make any sense – or have been written for them by a PR company. But despite invitations from the media and other scientists to defend their work none have so far accepted challenges to the accuracy of their formula. Instead they make the claim that they are leading the way in science communication or are using these PR opportunities to raise our interest in psychology, science, or mathematics.

Read the rest of her post, and follow the links I haven’t included, here.

We’ve heard discussion of beauty ideals for thousands of years — of proportions and ratios, of ideal weights, of complexions, of hairstyles, of curves or lack thereof, and of course of ideal behaviors. (There’s been… considerable differences of opinion, varying wildly not just from country to country or century to century but sometimes from one decade to the next.)

Oddly, according to a credibly-researched presentation I heard last winter on the history of the brassier from a fellow student in the sex ed, women’s studies, and communications course I was in, there was almost no discussion of the ideal breast size until garment manufacturers settled on a standard for bra sizes right around the middle of the 20th Century.

Sure, bras had been around for a few decades (and obviously, before bras there had been corsets that did similar duty.) But standardized bras had something the earlier bras and corsets hadn’t: cup sizes.

Industrial society, with it’s recent appreciation for economies of scale, already had a bigger-is-better attitude about a lot of things, but at least in terms of breasts there hadn’t been much discussion in the early 1900s about whether, say, Mae West’s ample bosom was superior to Mary Pickford’s slight one.

But suddenly there was a single measurement. And suddenly there was the opportunity for comparison. And suddenly there could be competition. And suddenly there could be (by-definition post hoc and easy to mock) “formulas for perfect breasts.”

Shear fashion

Wed, 2007-10-17 12:13

Responding to Esther November’s post against shaving (oops, that would be against women shaving — it’s evidently ok for men… oops, that would be against women shaving their pubic hair — it’s evidently ok to shave your legs and pits) on Associated Content, Selena Kitt takes up an argument I’ve made over and over.

What is this “Real women don’t shave!“ nonsense all about? The moral judgment there is enormous and completely unnecessary. Last time I checked, not every man had facial hair. They choose to shave–or not–depending on their personal tastes. I didn’t see any articles out there on “Real Men Don’t Shave!” — at least, not outside of the Amish or Orthodox communities, and I don’t think I’ll be seeing their views on the Internet any time soon. 

Read the quote in context here.

I happen to think one should be suspicious of grooming choices that happen to reinforce the dominant fashion dictate du jour, and even more suspicious of choices that, when taken, conveniently magnify gender differences inside an environment that seems to see such choices as not at all optional[*].

But it remains the case that for the most part shaving itself — the act of removing hair from one’s body — isn’t an issue at all. Outside of the “natural” fashion trend in the 1970s shaving armpits and legs have never been controversial. And outside of extremely orthodox religious traditions (Moslem, Jewish, and Christian religions for instance) it’s very generally given that men will shave their faces.

That the latest trend for men to shave their genitals hasn’t been met with anything like the angst, outrage, or sometimes enthusiasm that’s leveled against women who do likewise is significant of… something. That men who shave their pubes are often mocked or branded narcissistic rather than enthralled by fashion while women who do so are believed to be enthralled rather than narcissistic is also pretty interesting.

Hey, wake up! Seriously. I don’t mean it’s ironic, I mean it’s really interesting! It’s about double standards, sure (and Selena really drives that home in her post, which again is worth a read), but prematurely waving it away as merely a double standard is probably a mistake.

I’ve been reading Germaine Greer again and the observation that women are damned by pop psychologists if they do (look prepubescent) and damned by neo-Freudians if they don’t (denying or obscuring evidence of tangible genitalia) while men are mocked or ignored depending on their choices is pretty weird.

Bottom line: it either really does or really doesn’t matter whether humans shave. That we make it mean different things depending on whether men or women do it suggests we need less dismissing and more dialogue.

[*]See, for instance, one comment to November’s piece: “Hairy vaginas [sic —fl] are gross! There aren’t enough O’s in SMOOOOOOTH to describe my wife’s shaved vagina! Really nice!” That’s not representative of all positions. Another man says “I HATE THIS! My wife did it about a year and a half ago and now we hardly ever have sex. She looks gross. Her muff was PERFECT before, i.e. not overly bushy. Plus she gets it done by this idiot who makes her hair look like a teenage boy.” Both positions, however, represent men’s sense of entitlement in the issue of their partner’s grooming choices.

User login