feminism for men

Thanks To Feminism Women Can Afford to Hook Up With Starving Writers and Other Nominal "Losers"

Photo by Flickr user waltarrrrr. Cached as a bandwidth-conserving courtesy
Photo by Flickr user waltarrrrr. Used under a Creative Commons license.

Using her powers of feminism (and personal preference) Ozymandias dismantles yet another PUA restatement of the worthiness trap (a subsidiary of Rule #2.)

No girl wants to cuddle with an unaccomplished writer hack who lives in his dad’s basement.

I do! I do! Pick me!

Well, I mean, if he's nice, and attractive, and likes Star Wars. and enjoys going down on me, and can talk intelligently about some topic other than sports, because I am biased against sports. Which gets back to the main point: thanks to feminism (remember, Roosh? That thing where women can vote you were complaining* about before?), women get to pick their dates because of compatibility, and not because of their pocketbooks, because women have money too. You're not "pulling one over" on women when you fuck them while not  being rich. You're reaping the benefits of feminism, which made it so women don't care about how much money you have. Love used to be a trade of sex for money a little less crass than prostitution. Now it's the connection of minds and bodies, both primal and celestial, combining the highest and most animal instincts in the human soul, and it's some cool fucking shit.

Source: Ozymandias's Crushing and Venting Engine of Doom

Rule #2, you'll recall, says that it's not really conceivable for men to be just intrinsically sexually desirable and so if we want sex we've instead got to instead earn by doing or having things that are deemed admirable or worthy in some other dimensions such as a good income, a nice car, a heroic job like fire figher or rock star, political power, or some other form of "status" that women will trade sex to gain access to.

And so by that logic a starving writer (or, worse, gamer!) should never, ever get laid.

Except, as Ozy and others regularly point out, unless they're a complete dicks men like that actually get laid approximately as often as anyone else. Because, in fact, those Cee-Lo lyrics, "I guess the change in my pocket, wasn't enough. ... If I was rich'a I'd still be with ya. ... Yeah I'm sorry I can't afford a Ferrarri" are almost always wrong. Handy if, but mainly only if, you don't want to confront the likely real reasons a partner left you or wouldn't go out with you in the first place.

Actually... hmm... I have to admit I'm not enough up on the nuances of PUA culture but for all their talk about nice guys, alphas, and jerks I can't remember how PUA strategies are designed to cope with the fairly routine question "what does she see in that loser?" Where the loser in question clearly isn't an "alpha," isn't a jerk, and isn't really identifiable as "worthy" in any other way. But does seem to break all the rules about women not liking unremarkable but "nice" fellows. I'm not saying PUA culture doesn't deal with the question, I'm just saying it doesn't seem to percolate to the top of the usual lists.

* Earlier this PUA guy "Roosh" had said "Charm died in Western women on August 18, 1920" To with Ozy replied "When they got the vote! That Roosh, such a charmer."


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Hugo Schwyzer on SlutWalk's Stand Against the Myth of Men as Obligatory Assailants

Photo via Facebook. Cached as a bandwidth-conserving courtesy
Photo via Facebook from, I think, the Vancouver Sun.

Hugo Schwyzer says in support of the recent "slut walk" protest in Toronto. The emphasis is his but I heartily endorse it.

There are so many things that trouble me about the obsession with regulating women’s bodies. But as a man, I am particularly exasperated at the assumption that lies beneath the insistence on modesty: the myth that men cannot control themselves. As feminists often point out, the real “man-haters” are those who promote modest dress for women out of the belief that men lack self-control. There is nothing more contemptuous than the suggestion that those of us with penises and Y chromosomes are prisoners of our biology, liable to rape or commit infidelity at the first sign of cleavage. The myth of male weakness sells us woefully, heartbreakingly short.

...

SlutWalkers believe in men’s capacity to do two things at once: be aroused by what we see while honoring the humanity of the woman whose body attracts our eye. The most pernicious of all lies about men is that because of our make-up, lust and empathy can’t coexist within us. If you want kind and compassionate men who will respect women’s boundaries, the myth suggests, those women will have to conceal the parts of themselves that will turn men bestial and irresponsible.

We present women with a brutal binary: hide your sexuality and be respected; show your sexuality and be slut-shamed, harassed, or worse. But if ever there were a false dichotomy, rooted in ignorance about male identity, male biology, and male potential, this is it. While none of us want to live in a culture where women are compelled to display those parts of themselves they’d like to keep private, none of us should settle for living in a society where women are compelled to conceal those parts of themselves they’d occasionally like to display.

Source: Hugo Schwyzer

And I'd just add that the man-hating, slut-shaming meme isn't even about protecting women from all men (as a few feminists and most anti-feminists believe.)  Because research from the anecdotal to the latitudinal suggests that only a very small number of men commit the vast majority of sexual assaults.  So the message in the photo, to tell men not to rape, isn't a hopeless pie-in-the-sky recommendation: it's actually quite specific. And, I might add, a very much more-solid policy recommendation that telling all women to remain cloistered in the vestments of nuns, lest all men assault them.

Image suggestion via reader DA


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The Patriarchy Evidently Just Can't Stand the Way Women's Autonomy and Economic Independence Increases Men's Freedom

M'kay so you want a direct example of how anti-feminists a) hate men and b) believe the only role women should have in society is as bait for men? Matthew Yglesias has the goods.  Emphasis mine.

This put me in mind of Monica Potts’ review of Kay Hymowitz:

“Before [today], the fact is that primarily, a 20-year-old woman would have been a wife and a mother,” author Kay Hymowitz told the crowd of about 100 at the Manhattan Institute in New York City. Men would have been mowing lawns and changing the oil in their family sedans instead of playing video games and watching television.

Hymowitz’s argument, essentially, is that not only has feminism opened up new doors of opportunity to women, but it’s helped contribute to the growth of a society in which young men are less crushed down with family and household obligations and are spending more time enjoying themselves. Except she means this as a bad thing! In both cases the conservative conceit seems to be that a decline in human suffering is a bad thing because it leads to a corresponding decline in admirable anti-suffering effort. John Holbo memorably dubbed this Donner Party Conservatism.

Source: Matthew Yglesias

Got that?  Conservatives just fucking hate it when women have political and social autonomy, that they're approaching economic parity, that thanks to contraceptives, Plan B, and abortion they can have children when they want to and still have sex when they don't, and most importantly, that women can have men in their lives because they want men in their lives and not because they'll starve if they don't offer their asses to someone who'll support and "protect" them.

And why do conservatives hate women with social, economic, reproductive, and sexual autonomy?

Because with all that freedom they're not obliged to drag men down into early marriage, into greater responsibility, into ground down death-of-a-salesman lifespans.  Which means that men too have new freedom.

And before anyone goes all work-ethic angst-y about men "slacking off" I just want to point out that the ex anti baseline was... men working twice as hard as necessary in order to support an able-bodied partner who was effectively forbidden to work at all! In other words men are only "slacking off" relative to the Willie Lomans of conservative findom fetishists.  Fuck them!

Anyway, I think that really nicely illustrates how

  • Men benefit not only indirectly but directly from feminism
  • How conservatism views women primarily as bait to use to dominate and control men
  • How neither women or men are intended to benefit from the system of patriarchy
  • Why men ought to have as vested an interest in the outcome of feminism as women do
  • Why men should direct their ire not at feminism but the fucking assholes who want to use women to control men.

And finally,

  • How it's patriarchy rather than feminism that genuinely, truly, madly, and deeply hates and fears men.

I mean seriously! What decent person... what person with any hint of integrity or honor... what person in his or her right mind thinks the real reason women should be kept barefoot, pregnant, and chained to the stove is to keep men's noses chained to the grindstone?!?!?

Oh, and it's not just Hymowitz who blames women for men's happiness.  Yglesias begins his post with news that the American Enterprise Institute just hosted a whole fucking conference on the insufficient misery suffered by millions of American men and women.

Fuck them and the horse they rode up on!

Via Amanda Marcotte, who's own post excoriating the Right's viscious assault on men's happiness and freedom is called The War on Joy.

Update: But see also Echidne who catches conservative British cabinet minister David Willets being a little more honest: all those feminists are making upward mobility more difficult for men.


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Mormon Feminist Housewives on the Misandry Behind Anti-Feminist "Women as Guardians of Virtue" Messaging

ECS of Feminist Mormon Housewives takes note of some implicit male bashing from Elaine Dalton, president of the conservative organization LDS Young Women, by way of exhorting women to stay perched as high up on the pedestal as possible. (Emphasis mine.)

But then President Dalton tells us that if a young woman (i.e. a Guardian of Virtue) sends a sexually explicit text message to a young man, that this text message may “cause them (the young men) to lose the Spirit, their Priesthood Power and their virtue.”

By holding up women as “guardians of virtue” and telling young women that they “cause” young men to lose the Spirit, their priesthood, and their virtue, is similar to telling young women (the guardians of virtue) that young men cannot control themselves upon reading sexually explicit text messages.

Source: Feminist Mormon Housewives

Obviously some Mormons are feminist but LDS Young Women is decidedly not a feminist organization. You know how you can tell? Feminists don't believe it's their role in life to shepherd men.

There being far more non-feminist and (like LDS Young Women) actively anti-feminist women in the world it's not surprising that a lot of men pick up the idea that really is women's role. Or, another message implicit in Dalton's speech*, that shepherding men's sexuality is such a crucial role that women should withhold sexuality from themselves by not flirting, sexting, or otherwise having anything to do with sex.

Except, of course, when they come down off their pedestals to reward one man for being "worthy" enough to "deserve" it.  And, of course, once they're done not having sex even when they're ready to and want to, they have to turn around and start having sex even when they don't want to, or aren't even ready to.

The cool thing about mainstream feminists is that they recognize that men are perfectly capable of "guarding" their virtue, sexual or otherwise.  And therefore that women aren't obliged to be "guardians" of their own.

Anti-feminists?  Not so much.

What's funny is the way anti-feminists keep insisting it's feminists who hate men!  When you boil it all down feminists are mainly exasperated with men's learned helplessness.

It's worth noting that rather than being young herself the leader of "Young Women" is the mother of five sons and one daughter, and has ten grandchildren. One can only imagine what she thinks of her husband or how she raised her sons or how much pressure she put on her daughter!


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Worth 10,000 Words -- Explaining to My Children the Relationship Between for Feminism, MRAs, and Patriarchy

Photo of me reading Gary Larson's The Far Side Gallery to my children.
Photo of me reading Gary Larson's The Far Side Gallery to my daughter.

Almost from the first time I saw it in original form this comic has represented the relationship between men, feminism, and anti-feminist agitators.

The bulls in the pen, with the best of all possible intentions, exhort their doomed companion to be distracted by the cape when to the extent bulls have a way out of the ring at all they need to go for the matador instead.

  • The cape doesn't hate, fear, or make sport of the bull.
  • Even when the bull manages to trample, gore, and shred the cape as they sometimes do his misery and danger will never be relieved.
  • The matador uses the cape to enrage and distract the bull.
  • The crowd uses cape, bull, and matador for its benefit.
  • Occasionally the matador is hurt... not so much when the bull gets lucky, though, as when the matador is unlucky or "goes too far."
  • It's almost impossible for the men and women in the audience to be hurt by a bull.
  • On the rare occasions it is it's considered the work of a "deranged individual."
  • The whole enterprise is a barbaric sport.

It's still not a perfect analogy, obvously.  For one thing a bull can't make common cause with a cape.  Men, on the other hand, could find plenty of common cause with feminism.


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Who's More Likely to Force Jailed Fathers to Pay Child Support, Feminists or Anti-Feminists?

Despite being really, really not fond of MRAs Amanda Marcotte is actually pretty ardent about her support for men. Case in point: while she things divorced and separated men still support their children she also thinks it's evil to force indigent and imprisoned men to pay it.

There's a twist to the story, below, that I think makes the point that traditional, conservative anti-feminists are far more brutal to men than even the dead, white "radfems" of the decidedly radical 1970s. Emphasis mine.

But throwing men in jail for not paying child support is just stupidCharging men who are in prison and literally cannot make the money to pay child support for child support is just stupid. These are policies that not only hurt men that might very well intend to pay child support but can’t, but it doesn’t actually do anything to get the child support paid.  Men who can’t make money can’t pay child support, and being behind bars pretty much means you can’t hold a job.

I realize [expletive deleted] blame feminists for this, but it’s worth pointing out these backwards, punitive laws tend to be in place in anti-feminist, conservative states.  The reason behind them isn’t “feminazis out to get paid”.  It’s actually because conservatives believe that mothers are on public assistance not because they’re poor, but because they’re not married.  They still subscribe to this ridiculous notion that Mom + Dad + Baby = No Problems Ever Again, and figure that if people are struggling financially, it’s because they’re sexual deviants.  And so their child support laws are geared not towards making sure men pay for their children so much as punishing people for not being married, and punishing people for being poor.  It’s no good for the mothers, either, because they’re often expected to go to great lengths to try to get the money from the fathers before they’re permitted to get public assistance to feed their children. This is all rooted in a highly punitive view of gender roles and responsibilities, and no one benefits from it.

Source: Pandagon

I think that's about right. It is evil to hold non-custodial parents (it's not just men) responsible for child support if they're simply and legitimately unable to pay. It's particularly evil to use child support as just another way for legislators and prosecutors to pile on punishment than either law, justice, or (more to the point) penal theory would otherwise allow. And finally, as Amanda makes clear, it's also evil for social service agencies to refuse to provide assistance for children and their custodial parents (usually but not always women) when the primary-earning parent (usually but not always men) are also indigent. Or in jail.

But do check remember that not only do such laws tend to be more draconian in jurisdictions where feminism has less influence, many or most of those laws predate feminism by decades!

So once again, who really hates men? And if you were genuinely interested in men's rights, against whom would you rationally expend most of your efforts to resist their influence? In fact, who might you most logically want to form alliances to combat such oppression?

Oh, and last point?  At least in progressive jurisdictions legislators and courts, legislators, and society in general are all at least sympathetic to two crucial-to-men's-rights issues.

1) That divorce law and child support aren't strictly gendered, such that it's not enshrined that mothers stay home with children and fathers are responsible for all financial support, with the result that if a mother abandons her children or if a mother has more financial resources than the father then child support can go the other way, and

2) That opportunities exist for women such that they are economically, socially, politically, and legally capable of earning a living wage and supporting themselves and their children... or even their children and their ex-husbands if the husbands instead provided most of the primary care.

Items #1 and 2 aren't fully distributed yet, even in progressive, feminist-friendly jurisdictions, but they're a lot further along than in conservative, feminist-antagonistic ones.  Thing is, though, that traditional anti-feminists don't want women to have equal rights (these days they don't seem to want women to have rights at all!)  Such jurisdictions actively don't want men providing anything but financial support for their children (ok, maybe laudably beating them with their belts "when your father gets home.")  But sure as shittin' you're not going to find many feminists who want that for themselves or men.

 


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Why I Prefer Feminist Mormon Housewives to Man-Hating, Anti-Feminist Laura Schlessinger Any Day

Bingo!  Reviewing a book called The Proper Care and Feeding of Husbands by Dr. Laura Schlessinger,  Winterbuzz hits the nail on the head about Schlessinger reflexive and constant feminist bashing in the book (emphasis mine)

Let the record show that I, a feminist, have never condemned a man based on his gender. Her title alone suggests that males are “stupid” or at the very least on par with a barnyard animal.

Source: Feminist Mormon Housewives

That's just about as on target as it gets: when people ask me why I'm so comfortable with feminism, or why other men should be into feminism, it's because nobody hates men like anti-feminists hate us, nobody fears men as much as anti-feminists fear us, and nobody wants to regulate or control men as completely as anti-feminists want to regulate or control us.

And nobody, not even Twisty Faster, has more contempt for men than anti-feminists like "Doctor" Laura Schessinger has contempt for us!  As Winterbuzz pithily snarks of one tidbit of "advice" for wives.

"Thank him for bringing home his paycheck and not spending it on gambling or booze or drugs or women."

(Since you’re a man, naturally gambling, booze, drugs and women are the only things you’d like to spend your hard-earned cash on.)

Or check out this Schlessinger snippet of man-hatred Winterbuzz digs up.

[M]en are simple creatures who come from a woman, are nurtured and brought up by a woman, and yearn for the continued love, admiration and approval of a woman. . . Women need to better appreciate the magnitude of their power and influence over men, and not misuse or abuse it.

To which she replies

I am soooo tired of men being described as sex-crazed animals who can barely control their urges. I’m raising boys and this offends me. My husband, brother, father and children are more than lusty lions.

I’m not trying to get off subject, but I think this idea is so pervasive in our church, it’s needs addressing...

Does that mean there's nothing to criticize about men?  No.  But Winterbuzz makes the strongly feminist case that men are as subject to the system of Patriarchy as women.  And, also with strongly feminist sensibilities, she makes the case that the way out is not more of the anti-feminism Schlessinger and her male and female allies long for.  (Again, emphasis mine.)

Reducing men to sex-crazed animals who can’t control themselves absolves them from responsibility and self control. And while boys might lust after girls, society has proven that no matter what we do to curb this, it still happens.  It’s nature friends! The perpetuation of the species kinda depends on it. But that’s an argument for another day, the bottom line is girls should not be taught that their bodies are tools for the whims of men. Girls are objectified everyday in many, many way, and using religion to perpetuate those attitudes is called spiritual violence. Our church (and this book) objectifies women as domestic objects. And while our church might not mean to do it, it contributes to an attitude that continues to claim that men are weak, over-sexed animals and women are responsible to counteract that.

Got that last bit?  Anti-feminists don't resent feminists for putting men down.  They resent that feminists are refusing to sacrifice themselves to keep men down.  The complete failure to recognize this near mirror-image of reality is the source of almost all misunderstanding of the relationship of feminism to men. Because unlike women like Schlessinger feminists want to be men's peers, not our subordinates and certainly not our minders, mothers, wranglers, or butlers.  And straight feminists (and almost all feminists are) want partners they can respect in the morning.

When your entire expectation is, as Schlessinger approvingly quotes a caller as saying, "Men are only interested in two things: If I’m not horny, make me a sandwich," there's no, zero, none room for respect.

I'll take feminists any day, thank you.


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The Two Rules of Desire and "Girls Suck at Math"

Via Geek Feminism and Restructure!, it turns out there might be something else going on besides "girls suck at math" that keeps more women out of, well, math.

Skeptics might wonder if some of the [gender] differences [in engagement] among students relate to how well the students know the material. The researchers checked for that and found that, across sections, women outperformed men on grades. So the data point to women losing confidence with male instructors — even if female students know the material as well as or better than their male counterparts.

Link: Inoculation Against Stereotype (Inside Higher Ed)

Source: Geek Feminism Blog

Yes, the plural of lots of anecdotes still isn't data, but my observation in engineering, tech, math, and hard sciences -- in academia and even more so in industry -- has been that the biggest obstacle for women trying to get and do their work hasn't been their ability to do the actual work.

Incidentally, Penelope Trunk, who hasn't gotten the memo, still thinks it's all about brain differences.

One fundamental difference between the male and female brain is gray matter. And University of California at Irvine released solid data to explain why men are good at math.

“Evolution has created two different types of brains designed for equally intelligent behavior,” said Richard Haier, professor of psychology who led the study.

“In general, men have approximately 6.5 times the amount of gray matter related to general intelligence than women, and women have nearly 10 times the amount of white matter related to intelligence than men. Gray matter represents information processing centers in the brain, and white matter represents the networking of—or connections between—these processing centers.”

Source: Brazen Careerist

Not to sound all "don't have enough white matter to do interprocessing" or anything but gray matter is what we do math with, and if there are such vast differences between men's and women's white and gray matter then how is it possible that the average woman is capable of math as the average man?

Since that doesn't make any sense it must mean either that most men totally waste 5.5x of their 6.5x advantage over women in math-a-licious gray matter or... maybe something else is going on.

Based on the graceless quality and tone of the "congratulations" a friend of mine just got from her department head after receiving the highest NSF score anyone in her hard-sciences department has gotten in years I think it might be "something else."

The something else, incidentally, might be the worthiness trap conviction men have (doesn't matter if it's socialized or "genetic") that if they don't do better than women (let alone other men) then they'll never get sex.

You can't discount the effectiveness of that conviction, incidentally, or the grown-man-panic drive it can generate when a man's afraid he's going to be shown up by a woman.  Thank Rule #2 of the bogus  Two Rules of Desire for this -- if we're convinced women can't find us handsome and we're afraid they won't find us handy we imagine we're screwed... or more precisely not screwed!

Meanwhile women's worries about never getting sex run along pretty different lines (again whether it's socialized or genetic is kind of irrelevant.)

No one's asked me so far, but if someone did I'd say the difference in "...or I'll never get sex" accounts for far more of the differences in outcomes Trunk and others see in science, in sales, and in startups than gray matter ratios or "girls suck at math."


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Who Do You Want Your Definition of Feminism to Come From Betty Freidan, Who Loved Men, or Phyllis Schalfly, Who Hates Women?

Shannon Kelley, responding to a whole litany of anti-feminist lies originated by career lawyer, writer, national-level political consultant, prominent and influential conservative stalwart, and... professional propagandist for limiting women to domestic duties Phyllis Schlafly, includes this kind of foundational-to-feminism point:

Betty Friedan, pied piper of those dirty, man-hating feminists, once said that her tombstone should read: “She helped make women feel better about being women and therefore better able to freely and fully love men”?

Source: Undecided

Since one of (heterosexual) men's greatest anxieties is that women don't freely and fully love them you'd think there'd be more common ground between feminism and men's rights activism.

And so when you don't see common ground between them it's a good idea to look for any obvious obstacles.

And for me the most obvious obstacle is the concern would be people like Phyllis Schlafly who, based on both time spent in her public career and on whatever little amount of private or family life she's ever bothered to take time for, has never shown much in the way of love for anyone.

Anyway, I'd pick Betty Friedan's generous feminism to Schlafly's pinched misanthropy any day of the week.


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Do Men Have Some Catching Up to Do? Sure, But It's Not Women We Need to Catch Up With -- It's Our Own Supressed Potential

Image by Flickr user x-ray delta one. Cached as a bandwidth-conserving courtesy
Image by Flickr user x-ray delta one, Used under a Creative Commons license.

Reflecting Kay Hymowtz's latest lazy anti-feminist screed in the Wall Street Journal, Kay Steiger notes that

Kay Hymowitz and I might share a first name, but there seems to be little else that we share. She's written about dating and marriage in the past, saying, "By the early twentieth century, things had evolved so that in the United States, at any rate, a man knew the following: he was supposed to call for a date; he was supposed to pick up his date; he was supposed to take his date out, say, to a dance, a movie, or an ice-cream joint; if the date went well, he was supposed to call for another one; and at some point, if the relationship seemed charged enough—or if the woman got pregnant—he was supposed to ask her to marry him."

Source: Kay Steiger

Hymowitz is just so full of shit. That whole litany at the beginning about what men had "learned" by the beginning of the 20th Century? Any idea who all that learning, and the resulting behavior, was intended to impress? The prospective date's parents (mostly her father)... who at the time were still the arbiters of whether their daughter's "hand" would be given to the boy. For marriage or anything else.

The idea that increased empowerment for (young, single) women has automatically meant decreased power for their prospective young, single suitors is almost as novel as the idea that young single men have ever had very much power. Even if you were to buy Hymowitz's claims without reservation (which I wouldn't recommend) then the primary difference for young single men at the beginning of the 20th Century and the beginning of the 21st would be that decision-making power has shifted from young women's fathers to the women themselves.

And dear sweet mother of pearl let's not point out that Hymowitz's deprecation of today's callow, snot-nosed, "self-abusing" men is nothing compared to the combined scorn and anxiety heaped on them towards the end of the 19th Century.

It's not quite true that those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it. Instead it's that those who don't know history doom us to hearing the same alarums raised generation after generation.

Do men have a little catching up to do? Sure. But it's not women we need to catch up with. It's residual patriarchy -- internalized and external -- that's holding us back.

I'd just add that patriarchy being a co-ed enterprise, Hymowitz's punditry is part of the problem for men, not part of the solution.

I'd also point out that, predictably, Hymowitz's subtext isn't that women make men small. It's the classic anti-feminist subtext that men are such sniveling losers that the only way to make them look big is to hold women back. The reason I like feminism is feminism's enduring faith in men's ability to rise to meet ordinary expectations. Anti-feminists? Not so much.

And she wants us to believe that feminists are the man haters!


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