The The Over-Educated Nympho raises a perennial question about oral sex that I’d like to try out with the “no-sex” class paradigm filter.
Many of my girl friends and female readers have told me that their man doesn’t like going down on them. Why the fuck not, I ask politely. Cooch is awesome. I’ve gone bush-diving and I’m down for another round or eight any day.
I’ve always known that it was common for girls to find the penis icky – it grows, it shrinks, it waves hello, it shoots things in your eye– but I haven’t heard about many guys who don’t like going down on a girl. What the fuck is this shit?
This is one of those areas where in terms of discourse I don’t really see a lot of give and take. Usually eating in one direction is cool, maybe even obligatory, and the other’s an imposition. Or worse. Sometimes it’s the cunnilingus that’s the nasty duty, other times it’s fellatio that’s the act of oppression. Then there are the real traditionalists who say it’s all nasty. I actually happen to think most people think it’s fine either way but in terms of public narrative we just don’t really hear from them.
But in terms of discourse (as opposed to what people actually choose to do) the “no-sex” paradigm pops up a lot. Here’s a totally random selection…
- “Nice girls don’t suck dick,” of course, is the quintessential “no-sex” class mantra.
- So is the startled disbelief implicit in the epithet “cocksucker”
- So is the almost fetishistic avidity some men have for cunnilingus, seeing it as the key to “unlocking” women’s sexuality and/or distracting her from her gatekeeper role
- Same with the idea that cunnilingus is warm-up “play” grudgingly undertaken before “real” sex.
- Radical theorist Catherine MacKinnon staked her reputation on fellatio not only being undesirable for women but impossible without physical injury to them. She was widely misinterpreted even by the men in her audience.
- Men coin endless depricating euphemisms for fellatio to distance themselves from the possibility that their partners might enjoy doing it to them
- when women express concern about partners licking them “down there” men take it as adorable sexual cluelessness
And a couple of other slightly less random points
- Sometimes you hear people say “a woman is never more powerful than when she’s on her knees in front of a man.”
- Typically by which they mean “having a powerful effect on the man she’s fellating”
- Which says nothing about any effect she might have on herself.
- Oddly, when men eat their partners the effect can be every bit as profound
- Yet no one ever says “a man is never more powerful than when he’s on his knees in front of a woman.
But one of the real hallmarks of the “no-sex” class paradigm is that
- Men who perform cunnilingus on their partners are often spoken of heroically — either for “giving” his partner such a wonderful service or for putting up with the flavor and/or smell
- Women who perform fellatio on their partners are generally spoken of as “wild” at best or “coerced” at worst. It’s still seen as a service, yes, but generally as a routine service rather than a heroic one (even if she “swallows.”)
And finally, a couple of non-no-sex class points:
- For some reason when men won’t kiss their partners after fellatio they’re often accused of subtle homophobia
- For some reason when women won’t kiss their partners after cunnilingus they’re often accused of fastidiousness or increased sensitivity.
Looking at all of the above it’s not like there’s a definitive smoking gun, an a-ha… not even any real trend. Just a sort of floating tendency, a drift off center one way or another, such that the reasons given in favor of or against this or that form of oral sex never corresponds, never matches… rarely even comes close!
But stepping outside of all the above, I discovered years ago that eating a partner, performing cunnilingus, tasting and touching, seeing and smelling her, hearing her, feeling her hands on my hands, on my face, in my hair, syncopating myself with her rhythms, anticipating, teasing, rushing, harmonizing, completing her responses with mine. Is it powerful? Sure. Profound? Can be that too. But… it’s just… it’s fun! It feels great! I have to assume all that is available to someone else when she chooses to eat me. What are we missing that we so often miss that?
Submitted by 1460 (not verified) on Fri, 2007-06-29 06:12.
figleaf said:
# "Nice girls don't suck dick," of course, is the quintessential "no-sex" class mantra.
# So is the startled disbelief implicit in the epithet "cocksucker"
Is "cocksucker" used to insult women too? I've only ever heard it used in reference to men, and as such always saw it as a homophobic slur.
Also, that is a splendid photo.
[I agree it's used homophobically but I know at least some men use it in a very different context with women, especially partners. It's a combination of awe, contempt, gratitude, concern, enjoyment, and disbelief.
I'm glad you enjoyed the photo, Mattie. --fl]
Submitted by 1460 (not verified) on Thu, 2007-06-28 07:43.
I love, love, love love a man who knows how to eat me. It is a total gift, a major gift, awesome... So rare and so hot to find. The guy who enjoys my (clean) taste, scent, feel, all of it - I'll love him forever...
As far as giving head, I love pleasing him, from the warm weight of his balls to the satiny heat of his begging cock, I love the rock hard throbbing feel of him, the sight of his aroused cock, the delicious taste of him from his pre-come to his final shots, and the sounds of pleasure he makes just egg me on.
[Mmm. It all sounds lovely, Annie. Thanks. --fl]
Submitted by 1460 (not verified) on Wed, 2007-06-27 22:54.
Hey Fig,
Random tangent: your post reminded me of a couple experiences I had a few years ago with some female peers(we would have been in our late teens or just barely twenty).
I specifically remember one friend of mine on several occasions lapsing into long rants about how gross and ugly she thought her partner's genitals were, with an obvious tone of disdain and mockery. The first thing that always ran through my head was "Gee, if I were dating a guy and found out that he thought my body was 'ugly' and 'gross', let alone made fun of me for it in front of his friends, I would deem him to be a huge asshole, get rightously mad, and immediately dump him." I never understood why she felt it appropriate to talk about people she supposedly cared about that way (this was her long term boyfriend), or why she chose to continue dating and having sex with him or men like him if they were so unappealing.
I knew this woman pretty well, so I can (sort of) speculate that it was probably a power play thing for her, as she would often simultaneously brag about how much sex she was having and how 'badass' she was for being able to attract so many men. She may have also just been really internally conflicted/confused over which end of the Patriarchal straw to suck on and couldn't keep her stories straight.
This memory has always stuck with me and was probably one of the first times I became consciously aware of the social and self-imposed boxes that people are put into w.r.t. sex and sexuality. What I'd always thought of as a personal intercourse between two(or more!) equally invested partners was in fact often more of a socially-constrained performance. It provided a foil against which I constructed my own set of expectations about truly egalitarian, partnered sex and body acceptance.
[Hi Albinosquid, I think that last paragraph of yours was unbelievably eloquent. Yeah, we come together not just as ourselves but as little respositories of every myth, story, lesson, and speculation society can layer on us. Fine if society's expansive, not so hot if not. Thank you. --fl]
Submitted by 1460 (not verified) on Thu, 2007-06-28 09:39.
As a young woman I always prided myself on my awesome head-giving abilities. (Note: it's not so hard to be really great at going down on young men.) I always felt powerful and accomplished when I was doing it well.
Now, for the first time, I'm in a relationship where I am the dominant one, and I mean that literally and explicitly (he calls me Mistress). And I have not been nearly as good at bringing this one off orally as I was with past boyfriends.
It's not that he's especially difficult. It's just that for once this does not seem like a critically important skill. So I just have not dedicated the kind of time and attention to it that I used to.
Meanwhile, I am getting from him the best oral I've ever had. (For him, it is explicitly a service, though I think he enjoys it on its own merits to some degree as well. But nothing pleases him more than to serve.)
I've usually focused on my partner's pleasure to the detriment of my own, so it's wonderful to be doing the reverse for once - being really selfish. I also wonder if some of my thrill at going down on previous partners (men and the few women I've gone down on) was because it was one of the few outlets (however poor) for my naturally dominant qualities. Now I get that satisfied by doing sadistic things to my guy.
OK, didn't mean to wander so far afield here. Giving oral to either sex is fun, tasty, powerful, and joyful. Yum!
[Your point that there's something inherently dominant about eating one's partner is pretty interesting, Tam. I agree it's fun, tasty, powerful, and generally all 'round joyful. (Or, put another way, if it isn't then you probably shouldn't just decline to do it.) Thanks! --fl]
Submitted by 1460 (not verified) on Wed, 2007-06-27 22:19.
It seems to me that if we would just learn to love or even like ourselves, a lot of these sexual hang-ups would disappear. How do we do that figleaf?
[I actually think it might be the other way around -- if our relationships are built on a completely vacant but dominant assumption that women would rather not have sex and therefore men must manipulate them into it then how on earth can we ever learn to love or even like each other? Thanks, Cathy. --fl]
Submitted by 1460 (not verified) on Sun, 2007-07-01 14:01.
I've been thinking about language lately. I was pretty sheltered growing up (in the 80s), my exposure to sex was largely from mainstream movies and radio music, and the occasional book.
It seems like all the common sex-related words are negative and from a male point of view. What do you call a faithless man? What do you call a man who has no interest in sex? What do you call a grumpy/grouchy/uncooperative man? Why are all the stronger insults derived from sexual words?
What are the various words that mean, roughly, "to have sex"? What do they imply about the role of the woman? The language used to describe women's sexuality (and sexual parts) is also negative. How can a girl grow up and *not* have a negative view of sex, especially fellatio?
Deep down, I think the emotions that attach to those words still affect my view of sex and my view of myself, which is sad because I've successfully rejected much of the social narrative for women, and forged my own. I don't want to have power, I don't want to be manipulative. I want to be allowed to exist as I am, and to have a mutual sharing with my partner.
["I think the emotions that attach to those words still affect my view of sex and my view of myself" See, that's *exactly* what's got my undies in a bunch -- our language *makes* it harder for women to get into it. Which goes way out past where we want to go with that. Thanks, Swan. --fl]
Submitted by 1460 (not verified) on Sat, 2009-01-31 18:21.
Thanks for the interesting read!
All comments have been great...very informative and philosophical.
I want to know something...My wife over the last several years has become more and more adamant on us only giving her orgasms from intercourse and that me going down on her doesn't give her the same earth-shattering O's. What gives? I love the act of going down on my wife, the smell the beauty of the vagina, the delicate skin, the softness, the taste, everything. IN fact, I have gone down on her all of our marriage of 12 years until just recently and she has never gone down on me except once during marriage and a few times during our dating years.
I love the feeling of getting a BJ, however she has a gag reflex, and I've never been demanding, or insisting, or even guilt trip her into performing this act, however, just recently I've learned that some of her girlfriends and their husbands do give BJ's to their husbands and it's really been irritating that we talk about this, when she knows that she isn't doing this to me...very irritating and even frustrating.
How can I encourage her to try this very intimate and pleasurable act between two people again?
From what I've been reading there are ways to get around your "gag-reflex" and work on it together, but she doesn't even want to give it a try?
I would love to try to work on this together but she is so turned off that I've given up even talking about it, in fact it's beginning to build up a lot of resentment between us even for intercourse lovemaking, let alone the lack of the oral sex(NONE).
I beg of anyone to help me out here.
I would love any suggestions.
Please.
Sincerely,
Matt.
[Hi Matt. First of all I agree it would be frustrating if one's partner didn't want to be eaten. On the other hand it would probably be even more frustrating if they did and one didn't want to eat them. I'd obviously have to know more than most people would care to share about why your partner has lost interest in being eaten -- it could be anything from losing interest in the way you do it (which, I promise, doesn't have to be a reflection on you) to drifting away from the common wisdom of the 60's and 70's that clitoral stimulation is the only "proper" kind to having had enough practice with internal stimulation through intercourse that she just prefers that to increased or decreased libido to starting, stopping, or changing medications from heart medicine to hormonal birth control to anti-depressants. In other words it could be a *lot* of things. If she's willing to talk about it (not everybody is) that would probably be the best course. As for what her friends are doing with their partners, well...? I dunno, they're friends, not *her,* and it sounds like she's not interested. Which is also frustrating for you, obviously, but a gag reflex is a gag reflex and bad previous experiences may be in play there as well. So I don't know. (With luck another reader might chime in.) Good luck. --fl]