In the last chapter of Bonk: The Curious Coupling of Science and Sex
Roach points out that the study was somewhat deprecated because half M&J devoted the second half of the book to, um, misguided strategies for helping gay and lesbian people “turn straight.” The first half of the book, however, Roach says, is pretty interesting.
One tidbit that I’d think would have been worth the price of the book (Masters and Johnson’s I mean, Roach’s book is priceless) relates very nicely to the tradition of Osbasso’s Half-nekkid Thursday and issues of body consciousness in general. I highlighted the key pieces in the third paragraph.
For five years, Masters and Johnson observed and compared the laboratory sexual encounters of straight, gay and lesbian, and “ambisexual” couples. (The team coined the term to refer to nonmonogamous sexual opportunists who show no preference between men and women throughout their very busy sex lives.)
...
While some of the subjects were having sex with their spouses or long-term partners, others were doing it with a stranger — not a stranger of their choosing, but one assigned to them by masters and johnson. These latter men and women would show up at the lab, chat with the researchers, and, following a short orientation session, get down to business with a man or woman they had never laid eyes upon. While Masters and Johnson observed.
...
The team did mention that many of the men and women who had been assigned a partner worried that this person wouldn’t find them attractive. Oddly, the reverse anxiety never surfaced — no one seemed concerned about whether they themselves would feel any attraction to the strangers whose genitals they were about to experience in almost every way imaginable: manually, orally, coitionally.
Source: Bonk, pg. 298-299
Pretty wild when you think about it, right? Everyone worries more about how they look than how their prospective partners — even drawn out of a hat partners! — will look. It’s certainly borne out when you look at all the thousands of Thursday photos folks have posted over the last three years — how the harshest criticism, and the biggest trepidation, has almost invariably been from the poster him or herself… and from the occasional, random, and pretty-obviously-flame-seeking troll.
While it’s not actually related, I’m a bit embarrassed by my wrinkly/baggy clothes. Turns out, though, I’d have been even more embarrassed if they were tighter and neatly pressed. :-)
Happy HNT (or Half-nekkid Thursday!)
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Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Wed, 2008-05-07 19:36.
Well, presumably there's a selection bias - people who aren't up for the idea (of the M&J study, or of HNT) don't participate, and the ones that do are likely to have specific reasons for wanting to.
(Now I remember why The Forever War squicked me...)
[I think the big take-away, though, is that we're far harsher on ourselves than on others. Good point about "The Forever War." I'd forgotten about the details until I looked it up. I remember it as mostly suffocating but now that you mention it it was bleakly homophobic too. All in all a *very* 1970s, post-Viet-Nam book. Thanks, Jfp. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Wed, 2008-05-07 20:52.
See now, I *LOVE* this look. It's my favorite on a guy.
HappyHNT Love xoxo
[I'm not surprised, Vixen, but I'm still delighted. Thanks. Happy HNT. --fll]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Wed, 2008-05-07 21:18.
Ummm ... yeah ...
This one is definitely a tease, and I like it!
HHNT!
[Ooh, glad you caught it then, Dana. Happy HNT. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Wed, 2008-05-07 22:06.
It doesn't matter what you got on, I love looking at you. I agree with what you say here. I am my worst critic!!
[Thanks for your kind words, BBG. Happy HNT. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Wed, 2008-05-07 22:34.
The shadows in the wrinkles make your clothing look so touchable.
And it's interesting to see scientific verification of what my daddy always told me in high school--while you're worrying about how you look, everyone else is worried so hard about how they look that they hardly see you. We hold ourselves to so much higher standards than we do others.
[Smart dad, Holly. And glad you noticed the shadows -- it was overcast out so they weren't as strong as I'd hoped, but that was the idea. So thanks! --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Wed, 2008-05-07 22:41.
Well, if you were assigned to me, I definitely wouldn't be worried about being attracted to you. Yummmy.... :)
I'd help you iron, but...ermm...you're going to have to take those clothes off first. :D
Happy HNT!
[No ironing necessary, Ms I. But you're right, *steam pressing* would delightful instead. :-) Happy HNT. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Wed, 2008-05-07 22:54.
I already know I am my biggest critic on how I look.. and pretty much everything else. That is an interesting thing you posted though. I would think they would be more nervous about performance with a total stranger more so than if the person will find them attractive or not.
Wrinkly and baggy looks fine when it's done like that. Happy HNT!
[I know! You'd think even in the late 1970s which were sort of the pinnacle of "casual sex that people would have been more nervous about other people, but evidently not. Thanks, AR. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Thu, 2008-05-08 00:11.
Well, I try to make myself presentable when necessary, but I don't worry much about how I look. I simply don't have time and can't afford the additional stress brought by worrying. If someone doesn't like how I look, then I'll probably never know it, and probably wouldn't want to deal with them if I did. In terms of relationships specifically, if someone doesn't like how I am normally, what's the point? Okay, fine, some people think others should be seen at their absolute best upon first meeting. Those people are often too anal-retentive for me anyway.
And then there's the matter that the people who care most about your looks (both literal and figurative) are probably your rivals or enemies, not your friends.
[Interesting point, Nightfall. I'll have to ponder that a bit but it makes a lot of sense. Hmmm... Thanks. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Thu, 2008-05-08 02:45.
I have this thing about wrists and hands and yours are just mmmmmmmmmmmmm
When i was younger I was far more concerned about body image. Now I am so much more comfortable in my own skin and with a partner who loves and appreciates me as I am. I would expect anyone to now. I see anything less as their problem--not mine.
[Glad you like my forearm porn, Turnbaby. :-) And yeah, that comfort in your own skin is one of the reasons I really enjoy hanging out with older (ok, from my age now, younger but not that much younger) women. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Thu, 2008-05-08 03:24.
Interesting post, which leaves much food for thought about my own attitudes and self image.
Happy HNT
[Exactly! I remember being scared to death the first photo I ever posted, just dead sure I'd get the same treatment I did (and probably almost everyone did at some point) in high school. But... y'know, I think that's just another area where we carry a lot of stuff we get in high-school without ever re-examining if it's true in adulthood. Hmm.... Thanks, LR. And happy HNT. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Thu, 2008-05-08 05:33.
We hadn't heard about that M&J study, before. Thanks for enlightening us. Happy HNT!
[Thanks you two. Happy HNT to you, um, too. :-) --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Thu, 2008-05-08 05:41.
Rumpled is a good look for you ;-)
I completely understand where M&J's subjects are coming from. I don't worry about whether a potential partner will please me, I only worry about whether I will be pleasing to him (or her?).
HHNT!
[And the funny thing is he's evidently worried about you the same way. Thanks, Bunny. And happy HNT. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Thu, 2008-05-08 06:12.
My favorite look on a guy. Were you barefoot? That would make it totally awesome!
[Of course I was barefoot. (Although I *do* own shoes.) Thanks, Biscuit. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Thu, 2008-05-08 07:37.
barefoot??? oh yes PLEASE
Your post reminded me of the agonies of first dates ... the terror of not being good enough.
happy HNT
[Oh yes then. And yeah, it's funny thinking that not only were you terrified your partner almost certainly was too! I wonder how many defense mechanisms we throw up at each other and call it "routine!?!" Thanks, Bittersweet me. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Thu, 2008-05-08 14:04.
Great photo capture Figleaf! Phish-tosh! I don't see wrinkly cloths, I see a vey attractive body. I'm in the arm and hand kink as well so YAY for Figleaf! arm/handp0rn
Anyhoo I've always had low self esteam and self image and my mother has always been trying to get me to "dress better". Ahem. So one day she drops by the office for a visit or something, now I admit I paid to have a breast reduction so NOW I enjoy showing off what I have left over and my mother tells me, "It's okay to show skin dear, just don't show your bra!" and proceeds to tuck my bra back out of sight and adjust my blouse so I showed more skin! I got such a kick out that! What does this have to do with your posting, not exactly sure. Just wanted to share. HHNT Mr. Figleaf. :D
[Aw, I'm glad you and your mom get along so well, Raven. Happy HNT to you (and her!) too. --fl]
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Thu, 2008-05-08 18:59.
Really great picture. I like the teasing ones best, myself.
I hadn't heard of that study, but I definitely need to get the new Mary Roach. I just finished Spook, which was hilarious. And I totally understand the insecurity thing. I've been married 10 years now, and I still worry sometimes if I'll look good enough or please the husband. He thinks it's a silly concern, and I know it's a silly concern, but it's still there. We are our own worst critics.
Submitted by 2139 (not verified) on Fri, 2008-05-09 00:41.
casual fun & in jeans?! thats always my fave! happy hnt (late) 2 u ; )
[Thanks, Smile. Happy late HNT to you too. --fl]